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40 kids a year in care before birth



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Published Date:
17 May 2007
FORTY babies a year are being identified for fostering in the Lothians - before they are born.
Most are being taken from drug addict mothers by social workers immediately after birth for fear they may come to harm.

The move follows a series of high-profile cases where children have died or been put at risk. Most of the babies - many of whom are themselves addicted to heroin - are taken from their mothers' arms in hospital and placed with foster parents.

Many of the children will never return to their natural parents as they will never recover enough from their addiction to cope.

Drug experts put the growing trend down to "the Trainspotting generation", who became addicts in the 1980s and 1990s, reaching an age where many are having children. They predict the problem will get worse before it gets better.

Social workers in the Capital have also become more willing to intervene following a series of high-profile cases involving the children of drug addict parents.

Eleven-week-old Caleb Ness was shaken to death in 2001 after being left in the care of his drug-addicted mother and brain-damaged father in Leith.

Two-year-old Derek Doran died in December 2005 in Elphinstone, East Lothian, after allegedly drinking the heroin substitute methadone. Earlier the same year, a toddler also spent six weeks alone in a Leith flat with the body of his heroin addict mother after she died of an overdose.

Mental illness and alcoholism among parents are also triggers for social workers ordering placements for children even before they have been born.

But by far the biggest cause of the Capital's soaring childcare bill for employing foster carers, running children's homes and even renting out space in other city's residential schools, is drugs.

Kirstie Maclean, service manager for family based care at the city council, said: "We are getting quite a lot of tiny babies where it is felt appropriate care could be not be given at home by the parents.

"Some are new-born babies where the decision has been made before they have been born that they should be taken into care."

City social workers have found themselves under pressure in recent years due to the rising numbers of cases of neglected and abused children and increasing public scrutiny following the high-profile tragedies.

Tom Wood, chairman of Action on Alcohol and Drugs Edinburgh (AADE), said: "We are now dealing with the children of the 1980s drug-using generation.

"We know there was a rise in drug use in the 1990s as well.

"There's also more scrutiny after Caleb Ness. People working in social services are acutely aware of this issue and it's a top priority resulting in more intervention.

"In my view this problem is going to be with us for a long time to come -it may even increase."

The city council is looking for people to work as foster parents to try to tackle the problem. However, people who take on babies born to heroin addicts will have their work cut out.

Children whose mothers were on heroin while pregnant will suffer withdrawal the minute they are born, are likely to be underweight and could have contracted HIV or viral hepatitis in the womb.

Last year, AADE launched a service to try to help drug abusing mothers-to-be after it emerged around 40 babies are born addicted to heroin a year.

The number of women known to be taking illegal drugs while pregnant has risen from five in 2001 to 150 last year.

The full article contains 600 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

elayne,

17/05/2007 11:20:45

i may be niave,but WHY have kids when they dont have the mental capacity to look after themselves?why not wait until(if)they become clean/sober etc and spare themselves the pain of having the baby put into foster care.

2

Alasdair,

17/05/2007 11:27:23

Because they also don't have the mental capacity to remember to use a condom, I suspect.

3

Lesley,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 11:32:10

Having worked with children who a primary carers for drug adict / alcoholic parents and seen the damage that this does to the kids, I think this is an essential step to ensuring that they are allowed a life of their own and a chance to grow up drug and alocohol free. However, there is a basic lack of rehabilitation facilites available for adicts and until this is properly addressed, adicts will not be able to "clean themselves up". It can't be done without support.

4

alex paterson,

embra 17/05/2007 11:32:36

Take your drugs,Dont have sex,Enjoy and no harm is done to anyone bar yourself.=early grave.

5

elayne,

17/05/2007 11:34:41

#3 yes the kids should have a chance to have a childhood,not having the woe,shame and worry of babysitting parents who are too wasted to care for themselves and their kids

6

Darren, Edinburgh,

17/05/2007 11:41:43

re #3, re rehabilitation places, I agree. Labour & The Lib Dem coalition totally failed on this. I hope the SNP are better, although the only party manifesto I recall. stating they would plough money into this at the recent elections was the Conservatives.

7

James (1),

17/05/2007 11:45:26

Drug users are usually of low intelligence so they are not going to consider the responsibility of having children, so breed like rabbits. What else are they going to do between fixes? Get a job? No chance of that. They can however, to their credit make it all the way to the post office to get their benefit money.
Apparently it is ok for them to shoot crap into their veins but god forbid they were to take a prescribed drug such as a birth control pill.
The females should be given the pill along with their daily dose of methadone so that it is only their own life that is ruined.

8

James (1),

17/05/2007 11:51:10

And before any bleeding hearts come on and try to plead the case of these junkies by saying I am being too hard on them, can I say "YOUR WAY IS NOT WORKING" I say that because my hard line approach is not what is getting applied today. Your softly softly approach is, and it clearly does not work.
These people are users in more ways than one. They will continue because all they have to do is put on the " I'm really trying" face and their confidence trick works on the gullible.

9

Taras Shevchenko,

17/05/2007 11:54:18

I'm all for freedom of speech BUT posts like #1,2 & 4 don't add anything to a story of this nature - they make a mockery of and put into question if it's appropriate to provide the 'add your comment' section.

Thank goodness for people like #3. Lesley & #5. elayne.

10

elayne,

17/05/2007 11:58:23

#7,someone speaking sense!i have respect for those who can turn thier lives around and stay off drugs/drink etc and get a job and go from being addicts to people who contribute to society,fair play to them.but people on drugs/alcohol should consider contraception seriously,ok if they want to screw up thier own lives,but why do it to an innocent kid?more intensive rehab should be available to people who SERIOUSLY want a clean lifestyle and are willing to go through withdrawl and all that it involves

11

Calum Crubag,

17/05/2007 12:01:54

Elaine, you answered your own question in the first post. Many of these people are retards, to be blunt. They just don't have it. Many might not even know that f#king could lead to pregnancy.

Maybe the idea should be extended and children taken from all illegal and legal drug abusers - coke users, jakies etc... thus it's not just the poor that are getting targeted.

12

elayne,

17/05/2007 12:14:39

there are drug users in every strata of society,rich and poor,only the poorer drug users are the most visible

13

CATHOLIC AND PROUD,

17/05/2007 12:21:39

I have worked with many substance using families in the Lothians,and can confidently say that the number of families who could be classed as'jakies' etc.by the sort of people above, will only continue to rise in the absence of more intensive rehab services. Quite ironic that only last week it was announced that a project such as Brenda House is no longer to be funded.(presumably partly because they do not want it in the midst of the new housing developments in Craigmillar!!)Such a unique project as this, providing redidential rehab for mothers allowing their children to remain with them throughout, will likely be impossible to replace or eplicate in the Lothians.Perhaps the evening news should focus on campaigning to save crucial local services such as this as opposed to tryin to generate increasingly sensationalist/emotive articles in relation to the whole issue of parental substance use etc.!!

14

elayne,

17/05/2007 12:35:43

i recently watched a documentry about a new method of addiction treatment,involving a electromagnetic box,which the person wore for several weeks(6 i think)6 drug using women took part in this trial and following them up a few months later,4 were living productive lives and were drug free,one relapsed once and was recieving conventional drug treatment programme and one was back on drugs,this box treatment was coupled with counselling,helping with self esteem etc,and one could see a visible improvement in these women and a determination to get thier lives back on track,i cannot remember the exact name of the treatment,i think it came from the USA,something like this may help people who cannot get off drugs by methadone etc

15

DaveM,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 12:42:46

I'm sure an MSP was putting forward a proposal to provide an optional contraceptive in the methadone treatments a while back, but inevitably it got fired down with the 'civil liberties' cry... but why? As long as it's optional, surely it's helping people to be responsible.. and that can never be a bad thing.

16

Peter B,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 12:54:16

It's a crying shame that children should be born into that kind of life.

But listen, it's not just heroin - kids born to alcoholic parents far outnumber these.

And it's not thick low-lifes it's people from all backgrounds, walks of life and intelligence.

But for the sake of the children we've got to help not lecture, but for the grace of God.

Perhaps John Lindsay's £130 000 'redundancy' would be better spent helping folk like these.

17

Gizzabreak,

17/05/2007 13:15:47

The simplest answer is to abort the pregnancies of the junkies, sterilise them and then castrate the junkie boyfriends who got them pregnant!

That's what I call doing the world a favour!!

18

Peter B,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 13:30:14

Gizzabreak - go back to banging rocks together will you!

1. What's the kid done wrong that deserves to be aborted?
2. It's not your gift to decide which women can have chidren or not.
3. It's not necessarily a junkie boyfriend -it might have been you on a one night stand or with a hooker.

Or perhaps in your sad world women who drink or smoke during pregnancy should be strerilised and have their babies aborted and their partners all castrated? Where does society draw the line?

19

Jakey Rowling,

17/05/2007 13:32:44

I'm surprised the number is so low, given around 8500 births or so in the Lothians.

Credit to the authorities for trying to be proactive in this instance.

20

The Judge,

17/05/2007 13:42:18

Tom Wood, chairman of Action on Alcohol and Drugs Edinburgh (AADE), said: "We are now dealing with the children of the 1980s drug-using generation.

"We know there was a rise in drug use in the 1990s as well.

So after 27 years of leftie liberal thinking the situation has got worse and we are now left with the dregs of society popping out kids for higher benefits who'll in turn develop into criminals themselfs.

When is somebody going to say enough, and change the way we deal with junkies, dealers and associated criminals?

Stop giving out methadone it doesn't work.
Stop paying child benefits to drug abusers.
Stop pandering to junkies by giving them social workers and employee more police officers.
Stop handing down 2 or 3 year jail sentences for scumbag dealers.

Unfortunalty in Scotland even junkies have rights but taking away their kids might be a start.

21

Boy Wonder,

17/05/2007 13:48:33

18. Peter B. I don't agree with Gizzabreak, but she is entitled to her opinion. No need to get personal.

22

Repton,

edinburgh 17/05/2007 14:06:56

Very sad reading.If it was me I`d criminilise the use of drugs to the extent of making it a capital offence.We`ve pussyfooted around too much with this problem which is raging out of control.Untill someone comes up with a better idea it`s death penalty for drug dealers and jail for the users.

23

Peter B,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 14:10:26

#21 BW - I just get so cross when people are so insensitive and simplistic about the complex lives of others.

The Judge - do you have any idea of how many kids get born with FAS with apparently cosy middle class intelligent parents?

24

The Judge,

17/05/2007 14:20:50

#23 No idea, Im sure its quite a high number, but to me a junkie is a junkie, take away their children if we have to but make sure they are punished at the same time. The problems started when we gave junkies social workers instead of jail sentences so we could "understand" their problem.

Drug test(on a regular basis)new mothers before they give birth & take the child away if they have been abusing drugs, simple. That way everybody knows where they stand, take drugs and you will lose your child and more importantly for some your child benefits.

25

Hezza,

17/05/2007 14:32:44

drug addicts should have their sacs snipped and the lassies should have under-the-skin contraceptives implanted. These folk lead chaotic lives and mostly cause nothing but harm to those around them. They therefore lose their rights as soon as they shoot-up or smoke.

Anyone caught with a wrap of drugs = 6 months prison, followed by compulsory rehab.
Anyone caught with more than 4 wraps = 10 years minimum. They should clean drugs out the jails by inserting plastic screens in the waiting rooms, no gifts, external mail, no tv, no radio, no pool table.

26

Alastair1,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 14:38:11

I read an article a couple of days ago where a couple of addicts (supposedly recovering) were given their third course of IVF treatment to 'allow' them to have a child. In all likelyhood any resulting child will be brought into this world and fostered immediately. The authorities and medical people in this case stated that they should take no moral stance based on social issues. Someone needs to get a grip here and look at the impact on the parents (of having a baby taken away) the authorities then responsible for looking after the child and society in general. In my opinion they should not be allowed to have children, let alone be given vastly expensive treatments which I and most honest taxpayers out there are funding.

27

abracadabra,

17/05/2007 14:46:25

Put contraceptives in their methadone.
oops, I forgot that would infringe their civil liberties.
Forget the sympathy, these people are a cancer in our society and every working man and woman is financing them.
Rehab for these people is a complete waste of time and a drain on the already hard pressed NHS.

28

Peter B,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 14:55:49

Judge - the estimates are that FAS and other alcohol related birth defects run at least twice as high as other drugs.

My point is that we shouldn't stereotype drug dependancy on illegal drugs only - legal drugs are far more damaging across all of society.

Simplistic solutions will not always work the problem is complex and costing us a packet. But most of all we must have sympathy - firstly for the children, then for the many weaker willed folk who get into this predicament and for the tragic accidents when a pregnant women goes drinking before finding out she's pregnant.

29

GD,

Glasgow 17/05/2007 15:01:33

Let's lace all alcohol and drugs with a contraceptive substance. The more you indulge, the less you produce.
Would never get clearance of course, but interesting idea.

30

Rainbow V,

Edinbra 17/05/2007 15:11:09

Contraceptives in the methadone.

Poor kids dont deserve it and the damn junkies dont have any sense to use a condom.

'...oh im a junkie idiot with no life and no money - whats about the most stupid thing I can do - have a baby....'

31

elayne,

17/05/2007 15:30:35

i read about the couple who had twins after ivf treatment,would a more sensible solution be for this couple to have got totally drug free first,before embarking on ivf,the doctor who allowed this needs his/her head looked

32

Pickleskin 25,

17/05/2007 15:32:11

An extra potent batch of heroin on the streets would solve the problem!

33

Suzi B,

17/05/2007 16:08:17

#32. Pickleskin 25

Didn't you read the article? A toddler was left in a flat with his dead mother for 6 weeks after she died of an overdose. The thought of children left in that situation is terrible, so I hope that we don't see any extra strong heroin on the streets as you suggest.

34

Paula,

17/05/2007 16:58:52

Until recently we had druggies live across the street from us. Their daughters grew up feral and the authorities did nothing.

Druggies and drunks should lose the right to parent completely. There are plenty of welcoming families out there wishing to adopt and would offer these babies a far better life. And there would, as a result, be less neds in the future as these children were actually given a chance at a proper life and a proper family home.

35

Bell-the-Cat,

17/05/2007 17:11:50

When my child was born in the ERI a couple of years ago we were treated to the experience of sharing a 4 bed room with 2 junkie mums. They paid no attention to their pitiful, scarlet, screaming mites who were recieving glucose injections into their feet, and the new mums were feted by a stream of social workers. Both ladies insisted on using their mobile phones in the ward, and it was during a loud conversation that we were treated to the information that now she had a 3rd bairn she'd be oan an incredible amount of benefits, her hoose wis gittin redecorated, and she wis gittin oan the disabled soon nthat. Their attitude to staff was appaling, and the behaviour of one new dad (faither ay the latest yin) caused me to shake the chap by the throat.

These parasites are the new aristocracy in this country. Abrogated of all responsibility, they have an army of "support" workers running after them. We are the mugs. This comes from a socialist who grew up in Niddrie, and knew real poverty.

36

hassan i sabbah,

17/05/2007 17:33:30

Who made you you the judge? perhaps there are things about you lifestyle I disagre with? can I decide to take action against them ? -you are not a judge you are a worringly facistic tube.

37

James (1),

17/05/2007 17:54:40

#36 I don't know who you are refering to, can you clarify?
If it was #35 then the problem would seem to be people like you #36 who are perpetuating this problem.

You are too spineless to stand up to these parasites and see good where none exists.
Your solution is if we all join hands, close our eyes and wish really hard then everything will be ok.
You are a fool!
Everybody is permitted to get on with their life as far as you are concerned and me for that matter.
You forget however but I don't that WE are paying for their life style not them, US.
If they want to breed like rabbits and shoot crap up their arms then let them go ahead but don't use my money to keep them and their off spring.
All these kids will learn is how to sponge of the saps that we are.
Parasites are what these junkies are and they will raise the same.

38

The Judge,

17/05/2007 18:18:30

#28 Im sorry but I cannot and never will have sympathy for a junkie, why should I? Personally I'd ban most "legal" drugs too & if you smoke during pregnancy then you should be brought up on charges of child neglect.

#36 If you saw a child put its hand in a fire would you stop them? A lot of junkie parents let their childen injure themselfs every year because they cannot be bothered because they are out of it or just don't care about the child. Most junkies just see children as free money, a route into housing and a social worker who'll protect their rights.

Its time we should be tough because 40 is the tip of the iceberg.

39

elayne,

17/05/2007 18:50:27

i personally think that drug addicts who actively go and get pregnant are irresponsible,if they make an effort to get clean,stay off drugs and THEN have a baby,fair play,you cant really knock them but the sad reality is that very few do.too many kids today are brought up in unstable drug/drink related environments and this really is unfair for these kids,ok social workers etc may see that their material needs are met(new clothes,help with housing etc),but how can parent/s who are only purpose in life is to go out scoring and all that this involves(shopliftig to pay for drugs etc)meet the kids other needs,emotional,social(drug users only tend to pal up with other drug users),the kid is stigmatised at school etc,(schoolyard mafia"did ye know wee jonnys ma an da are oan drugs"=wee jonny doesnt get invited to parties etc )wee jonny grows up excluded and angry and ashamed,unfair or what?

40

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 18:52:28

Kids are born into all sorts of circumstances. The point being that society is judged on how we care for the weak, impovrished, vulnerable and elderly. We have developed very sophisticated means of doing so, therefore it us up to us to continue the support for these people lest we be judged failures.

41

Kenny A,

17/05/2007 19:49:09

#40 Dave

To the point. Cant stand druggies but the kids are often the ones left looking after the whole mess.

As to a number of comments earlier about banning drug users from having childern where do you draw the line. Nicotine is a powerfull drug and as for Alcohol thats the top point of the pointy pyramid.

As a smoker (regret it) and a drinker (dont) all circumstances should be taken into consideration.

Looked after my childern bloody well and will go out on a limb for basicaly any child, regardless of the state of the parents.

Blame not the babies for the sins of their parents but give a good shouting at when required.

42

James (1),

17/05/2007 19:54:18

#40 Aye lets send these junkies on a wee trip at our expense shall we Dave, but to where? Lets say Barra.
Feel so loving and giving now Dave when all these spaced out junkies decend on your wee paradise?
You will be happy when your house in broken into and your property stolen. I can feel the love from you when that happens.

What's that you say? Whoa, whoa, whoa, we dinnae want them here. I thought they would be treated in somebody elses back yard.

You are another do gooder who does not have a grip on reality.

43

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 19:57:00

Indeed Kenny. Gave up smoking a few years ago, but still take a wee dram. Alchohol and alchoholism creates more disadvantaged kids than drugs, but since it's legal, it's considered in a different light to drug abuse.

We might not have the same drug problem on the islands, but we have out share of problems but we deal with it well, don't yout think?

44

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 19:59:38

James

Whit a tw*t you are. Get a grip son. I care about the kids who will be born into these circumstances regardless, I do not care about the junkie.

No f*ck off.

45

James (1),

17/05/2007 20:01:09

#41 Apples and Oranges.
Do not try to compare heroin with alcohol for the damage it does.
If you think they are comparible then you don't know what drug addiction is.
There is no doubt both items cause grief.
We are talking about junkies breeding. Then being allowed to keep their children. Both are wrong. For a start they should not be allowed to breed and second if they do and are known junkies the children should be removed ASAP. The adults cannot look after themselves so will not look after there children. I agree it is not the childrens fault, it is ours for letting remain with the parents.

46

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:04:04

Nobody is talking about the junkie keeping their kid. We have mechanisms to deal with that, your last sentence is exactly what both myself and Kenny are talking about.

Now away n sh*te

47

James (1),

17/05/2007 20:04:43

#44 Dave I am shocked! Is that how they speak in hoochter choocter land?
I thought it was always sunny, you doors were always open and a welcome in the hillside.
Are you telling me that you don't want junkies sent to you for them to recuperate?
The meenister will be furious with you.

48

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:10:10

We have junkies here sent from all over the UK to dry out. Best place for them. No drugs to buy, watched by all, surrouned by sea, no escape.

We don't judge, we get on with getting them back on their feet, like we do for our own drunks.

49

elayne,

17/05/2007 20:10:15

the whole junkie lifestyle revolves around obtaining drugs,staying high, etc,pretty chaotic,especially with kids to consider,im sure many junkie parents love their kids,no one is questioning that,but the whole lifestyle is not conducive to running a home and looking after a family,and sadly its the kids who suffer the most,so it is silly for people who are using drugs to even consider having them,nor will having a kid mend a chaotic junkie relationship.,as i have said before if a couple/person can get clean and stay clean,,THEN is the time to consider having kids

50

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:10:55

And it's Catholic country here, so that would be Preist sunshine.

51

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:12:44

elayne

Agreed. That is why we have developed mechanisms to deal with it and deal with it we shall. Otherwsie we fail as sophisticated, sentient beings. People fek up, but people can find solutions to problems.

52

James (1),

17/05/2007 20:16:11

Holy Mary, mother of god! What is a Preist?
The children are not to blame and on that we all agree.
What we don't seem to agree on is that junkies should not be allowed to breed.
If that were the case, children would not be an issue and only the drug problem needs to be addressed.
But as we have to pander to these low lifes and give them more respect than the give themselves we end up standing watching the crash about to happen.
We have tried the "group hug" method and at some point we need the " get tough" method.
Lets (just a suggestion) build an open prison on Barra and send the junkies there for the hard treatment. Ideal surrounding and no suppliers

53

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:19:43

How do you identify what is a junkie? What do you propose? Force them out of their homes and up here? We only know they are junkies when they declare that they are, by that time it's too late for them so we concentrate on the kids.

Barra is an open prison already, what's your point apart from petulence and insincerity?

54

elayne,

17/05/2007 20:21:09

im no lover of drug addicts,but i do respect those who get clean and stay off drugs,it is sad that drugs have got a grip of so many people and so many lives are wasted,people who seriously make the best effort to overcome addiction and stay clean/sober deserve a pat on the back,these people are also ideal to help others who want to make a serious attempt to come off drugs/drink

55

James (1),

17/05/2007 20:30:22

#53 In big cities there are places called COURTS.
In these places people, lets call them junkies, give the SHERIFF (he or she is the boss) their sob story of why they mugged (beat up) the old person or broke into someones house to get other peoples property to sell so they could buy DRUGS (not over the counter stuff you understand?). There is you junkie. Self confessed in an open court. The sheriff could then sentence the junkie to a term in prison (thats been built on Barra) as way of paying back their dues to society.

56

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 20:33:16

Sigh...I was right, you are a tw*t.

Never mind.

57

Do you know where hell is?,

17/05/2007 20:36:51

#36 Total fanny!

58

James (1),

17/05/2007 20:53:35

#56 Witty retort! But at least you now know how we in the big toons identify junkies.
Learn something new every day. Speak to you tomorrow.

59

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 17/05/2007 21:07:35

Yes james because I've never been on the mainland. Sigh.

Yup, tomorrow old bean.

60

Em,

17/05/2007 21:13:11

Lets get to the heart of the matter which is why is the drug trade being promoted in the first place.

The occupation forces in Afghanistan are supporting the drug trade, which brings between 120 and 194 billion dollars of revenues to organized crime, intelligence agencies and Western financial institutions. ( I can smell the Rothschilds and Rockerfellers a mile off)
The Golden Crescent drug trade, launched by the CIA in the early 1980s, continues to be protected by US intelligence, in liason with NATO occupation forces and the British military. In recent developments, British occupation forces have promoted opium cultivation through paid radio advertisements.
While the controversial opium ads have been casually dismissed as an unfortunate mistake, there are indications that the opium economy is being promoted at the political level (including the British government of Tony Blair).
The Western media in chorus blame the Taliban and the warlords. Western officials are said to believe that "the trade is controlled by 25 smugglers including three government ministers.
Yet in a bitter irony, US military presence has served to restore rather than eradicate the drug trade, which has increased 21 fold since the 2001 Us-led invasion.
What the media reports fail to acknowledge is that the Taliban government was instrumental in 2000-2001 in implementing a successful drug eradication program, with the support and collaboration of the UN.
Implemented in 2000-2001, the Taliban's drug eradication program led to a 94 percent decline in opium cultivation. In 2001, according to UN figures, opium production had fallen to 185 tons. Immediately following the October 2001 US led invasion, production increased dramatically, regaining its historical levels.

61

Ms G,

Old Town 17/05/2007 21:23:47

#20
I think there has been anything but "leftie liberal thinking" in fact quite a reactionary response to drug abuse. The current "war on drugs" just doesn't work

"Stop giving out methadone it doesn't work"
Indeed it does not - offer heroin on prescription. Get addicts off heroin and do not offer methadone unless there are specific health issues.

"Stop paying child benefits to drug abusers".
It's an idea but what about the kids? Unless there is a position to take all children of drug abusers into care - then the community will have to be more responsible adn more people will have to foster and adopt. MAny children remain in situations that are not good as there is no alternative to family life e.g foster families

"Stop pandering to junkies by giving them social workers and employee more police officers".
What do you think the social workers are doing? They will be assessing and reviewing the needs of the children, supervising Probation Orders, Drug Treatment and Testing Orders, assessing for rehabilitation or drug reduction programmes. Iw ould argue that we need more social workers not less. What would the police being doing? If you go to prison now the law says you must have a criminal justice social workerto supervise you.

"Stop handing down 2 or 3 year jail sentences for scumbag dealers".
Yeah we need a realistic response to drug dealers - it is not a "victimless crime".

62

Waspy100,

17/05/2007 23:07:41

James(1)
After reading your posts I seem to think there is something wrong with you.
It is fine to voice an opinion but when it becomes vitriolic you have lost the discussion.

63

Waspy100,

17/05/2007 23:12:48

And Ms G

64

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 23:32:50

"Life Sucks" don't it? at times! we have been trying to get Pregnant, now for 9years! yes we both have small problems, that can be sorted out, if we could get the help, even the funds drug users get! from the NHS!
Its very unjust, when we want "ababy" Soo much!, that will be, looked after 1001% and Loved 1001% and cant get a "fifth off the money", drug users get spent on them, from the NHS
Ah! that's the "secret"!!! "come on honey" lets smoke weed! lets then have a fix, "OH GOSH" we are pregnant now! lets get? "REHAB" then we can keep the Baby!
"Golly-My-Gosh" this is all covered under the NHS!
And as for us???... a couple married, with Jobs, a wife that Looong's "tohaveaBaby" that works in childcare, gets very little help from the NHS, "tomakeababy"
Where did we go wrong? I suspect its because we dont take drugs!
Anyhow BBC3 are showing a New Programme on July14th at 9PM that runs for 4weeks, its called "MAKEMEABABY" we are on it, but it all seems such a waste! when we read stories like this!

65

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 17/05/2007 23:36:17

Should read June 14th 2007 not july

66

BW2,

Everywhere 18/05/2007 02:33:20

I have some sympathy for the Junkies, Who after all are the victims of Drug Dealers.
Are we as an society to punish people for no fault of their own.
Punish the real dealers with heavy sentences and support and help their victims.
Maybe then our society will be a better place

67

Pickleskin 25,

18/05/2007 08:22:08

No fault of their own....how bout them saying no?!!!?

68

,

18/05/2007 08:51:25
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
69

,

18/05/2007 09:17:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
70

James (1),

18/05/2007 10:01:10

#62 thank you for your observation. Can I point out tht whilst you were sitting on your high horse passing judgement on me and also #63 you failed to comment on the actual article.
Are you new to this? Please try to pass on your opinion about the subject so that we know where you stand on it.
If all you wanted to do was let me know how you feel then please be aware that I don't care.

71

angryman9,

england 18/05/2007 11:01:39

I am going to support James 1 in his views here. Sterilization should be an option;most of these people ARE of low intelligence,and they DO breed like rabbits. It is not vitriolic to try to find a solution that will prevent harm coming to children born to feckless irresponsible people who don't give a damn about anything but their fix. We have created a society in which MILLIONS of people think it is the duty of the state to provide them with their every need,so that they can live a life of indolence and ruin at the expense of the rest of us.

72

James (1),

18/05/2007 13:23:21

Thank you #71 but can I state that I am not for sterilization of addicts. I was going for enforced birth control whilst they were addicts.
By making sure whilst still taking drugs and also getting treatment they could not reproduce.

Hard line, but in my view we have tried all the soft options and are reluctant to accept it is not working.

I am sure some junkies will be able to get off this crap and then lead "normal" lives. To deny them child birth when not addicted is not my view.
If you can make the decision to have children then part of that process should be having decided YOU could look after them.
Being out of your face on heroin does not make you a person who should be given that option.

My views are no base on trying to make other peoples life more unbearable, it is to stop those who are irresponsible bringing children into the world who will have no chance without being taken into care. No children in care means no burden on others to keep them.
Parents should look after their own children. Like puppies they are not just for christmas.


 

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